Hmmm. It could be that they’re waiting on a proper consensus from the scientific community, or maybe it’s just backed up by more pressing matters.
Whatever the case - treating dolls as real child abuse becuase of the unfounded fear it may serve as a stepping stone to actual abuse is beyond senseless. I hope the Danish people can see reason. Reason must prevail.
There are multiple lawsuits currently planned by several groups. I happen to be part of a group of pedophiles, who are trying to organize legal action. More about it here.
The German government wrote something similar to justify the ban against child sex dolls:
The new Law is supposed to send a signal to society that children – even if only as physical recreations - must not be the object of sexual acts.
It scares me too, as it shows a clear motivation to criminalize the thoughts and feelings of pedophiles, no matter whether they actually hurt a person or not.
This is probably because the law on this topic is very convoluted and unnecessarily complicated. Even some lawyers are giving advice on this topic that is plain wrong.
In terms of fictional child pornography, the law in Germany distinguishes between realistic and clearly fictional material. Realistic child pornography is when a neutral observer cannot say whether the image or video depicts a real child.
When realistic child pornography is concerned, even the possession is outlawed (although it can still be used by law enforcement to gain access to private platforms). However, with clearly fictional material only creation and distribution is outlawed, not possession.
(Links are all in German, but still included since sources are important)
Interesting. I read some articles and the Federal Minister of Justice was against an increase in penalty for CSAM and also against the doll ban. Media then started doing its thing and claimed that she is protecting pedophiles and supports it. Everyone was pressuring her and literally 24 hours later she completely turned around and agreed on everything she just denied prior.
It is infuriating that very important and powerful people give in so easily. They are the ones who have to make sure that reason prevails. In the Bundestag protocol, where the politicians argue about the dolls, you can see that those who want them banned did not once use scientific data. They merely try to make baseless connections: police has found those dolls on CSA and distributors of CSAM therefore they promote abuse. The official german protocol can be found here: https://dserver.bundestag.de/btp/19/19187.pdf#P.23549 Anyone interested go and filter by “Sexpuppe” and translate their sentences.
A Nation’s Greatness Is Measured By How It Treats Its Weakest Members
This does apply to pedophiles especially now where even their thoughts are criminalized.
That is precisely what happened.
On June 10 Christine Lambrecht (the Federal Minister of Justice) said in an interview: “The call for increased punishments across the board for child pornography does not lead anywhere”
On June 11, she said: “I want criminals, who earn money with child pornography in the most disgusting ways imaginable to be punished harder”
(Translations are a bit awkward, but you get the idea)
It’s unclear what exactly happened. In an interview she hinted that she and her family was actually threatened after she said that she did not want to increase punishments. Upsettingly, nobody seemed to be concerned about this and it was mostly dealed as something that naturally happens to people who do not want to “protect children”.
Also upsettingly, a child protection agency was actually significantly responsible for the ban on child sex dolls. They started a petition that quickly gained over 100k supporters. The idea was then quickly baked into the change of law the ministry was proposing at that time anyways, and then passed despite no evidence and basically all experts telling them that it was a bad idea 
This right here is proof of why it might not survive scrutiny. Bullying by the populace is not what drives valid or solid policy.
I predict a silent reversal of Germany’s doll ban in the coming years.
They are dolls… they are literally incapable of doing just that.
There are actually dolls with voice features. There are even sex dolls with artificial intelligence. Dolls you can program to say whatever you want, or respond to something you have programmed them to. That’s nothing bad tho, because again: Dolls are not human and don’t need protection.
that’s precisely the kind of fearmongering shit that drives people to go crazy.
It doesn’t change the fact that it’s entirely harmless, though. We need ample data to prove what we already know, that these dolls do not cause pedophiles to go out and rape just like those corny adult sex dolls don’t drive men to go out and rape women.
Since we were talking about Germany. Did you know that according to §6 StGB every human being, regardless of their nationality, or the laws of their country, can be prosecuted on german grounds for §184b when they are known by officials to have distributed, or produced lolicon?
Section 6
Offences committed abroad against internationally protected legal interestsRegardless of which law is applicable at the place where they are committed, German criminal law further applies to the following offences committed abroad:
[…]
- dissemination of pornographic material under section 184a, section 184b (1) and (2) and section 184c (1) and (2), each also in conjunction with section 184d (1) sentence 1;
[…]
This is exactly why you should not include fiction in the same law that regulates CSAM. So in theory any japanese lolicon artist can get put in jail when they come visit. I doubt they would do that, but it is possible. Other minor offences are only punished when the criminal is of german nationality, or has hurt a german §7 StGB.
Apparently there is still some common sense in Denmark:
If the drawing explicitly calls for violence on children, then it is illegal after the Danish criminal code. However, if it’s ‘just’ an expression of an imagination - that is, if it is not about a real child - then it is difficult to say that it should be illegal. As there are many things that should then be illegal (she probably refers to violence). Personally, I’d like it to be forbidden. Because it’s so nasty and uncomfortable to watch, and it’s such a breach of my moral code. But now it’s just drawings. There is no real victim. And the law is not determined by the morality of individuals. We have freedom of speech.
- Senior adviser at Save The Children Denmark, Gitte Jakobsen
A tear of joy rolled down my eye as I breathed a sigh of relief from that. Thank you.
Sexual violence, maybe? I mean it really doesn’t matter. Such things do not cause real abuse, nor do they contribute to a predisposed individual’s risk of sexual abuse.
If you can do some more research on their position with regard to fictional/simulated child pornography, that would be most helpful. Maybe write an email?
It still doesn’t make sense to take such a hard-line moralistic stance against dolls if you believe in free speech.
Probably because drawings are considered art, or free speech. It’s harder to use freedom of speech as an argument on sex dolls thus they’re easier to ban. I read some of her posts on Save The Children and she seems to be very rational unlike some other members of that organization.
And as you can see even she is disgusted, but she can look past her own morals. I doubt that everyone is as intelligent and rational as her on this topic. (Psychologist in my initial post for an example).
So long as she agrees that lolicon/shotacon is art and free speech, with no real reason to ban outside of petulent morality, then I don’t see any reason to disagree with her.
Please double check if you can to make sure that she was referring to pornography, not just violence.